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Post by SirRobin on Jul 6, 2008 7:32:17 GMT -6
I think it was less of "Roxx jobbing" and more of "Roxx putting an old rival over on her way out seeing her Shimmer appearances may become less"
I mean it does boost Ariel to have beaten her.
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Post by Stevie on Jul 6, 2008 7:41:48 GMT -6
Jeez, Steven, could you be any more negative? OK I respect your right to your opinion but I have to ask: since 75% of the roster apparently "do nothing for you", why do you even watch? for ring marvels from Melissa, Daizee, Lacey, Del Rey, Stock, Wesna, Kong, MsChif, Mercedes, Lufisto and other alumni no longer with the company. The undercard is really weak now IMO and I don't enjoy watching most of the matches from there. And with a lack of top talent this taping, it does look to be one of the worst tapings yet. I am a fan of the company and what it represents but that doesnt mean I have to enjoy everything it puts out, if fans aren't critcal how can it improve? Fair enough. There's nothing wrong with criticism - if it's constructive. I just found your tone to be negative for the sake of being negative, with nothing in it that would help the product to "improve", maybe that's just me. I for one can't wait to see these two on DVD.
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Post by SirRobin on Jul 6, 2008 7:48:21 GMT -6
Me either, I'll miss Daizee and Lacey but it was cool that Allison Danger was able to return from her injury and it's cool to see Lufisto and Nikki Roxx back, and I'm also psyched to see Portia Perez receive a push and pick up two wins in a row.
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Post by Demonic Eeyore on Jul 6, 2008 7:51:59 GMT -6
This small group just attaked Danger & Del Rey all night long. Del Rey you could kind of understand since she's gone all demonic and stuff but even with her it went beyond heel heat. Stuff like "You've got nothing Del Rey, you're all blown up, you're a has been, put more make up on because you're still ugly". Del Rey got hot and actually pulled Ariel over to the ropes right in front of them and tortured her and said "this is for you" to the ringleader. But Danger? Jeez, I actually felt embarrased to be a wrestling fan and even embarrased to be a local fan for fear she thought she these people were "ours". (They aren't locals, by the way since they were asking people around about AAW, our local promotion that also runs out of the building that Joey would plug between matches). Since they were on the hard cam side you figure it's going to show up on the dvd soundtrack unless Dave can find a way to get it off of there. It wasn't heat, it was disrespect. Danger's trying to do a promo on Portia and the ringleader guy is yelling OVER Danger so you can't even hear her. It was during her 2nd match that she just snapped and yelled at the guy "Why don't you shut up! No one paid to see you! You're what's killing off wrestling fans" and he went right back to yelling at her "No one paid to see you! How much Reynolds Wrap did it take to make your ring outfit? blah blah blah" and on and on... you just wanted to crawl under your chair. basically making fun of her outfit, telling her she can't wrestle, calling her useless, saying no one came to see her.... just crap like that. There is heat and there is disrespect. Don't know if it's the$1 drinks or people just trying to get themselves over but it needs to be stopped. From Dave to the boys in the back you need to protect your talent from personal attacks. As a worker you need to have thick skin but when you have to take yourself out of a match to stick up for yourself someone dropped the ball.
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Post by Demonic Eeyore on Jul 6, 2008 7:56:05 GMT -6
Yes, the backfist really jacked Lorelei up and she was visibly crying hard upon leaving the ring so Daff worked 2 matches on Vol. 20. The day is upon us. Billy is in Chicago and will be texting the results as they happen to myself. I will edit this fist post only to keep them on top. As the show goes on if anyone has any questions feel free to post them and I'll ask Billy. If he's able to send and answer you'll get it. To those at the show have a great time. To us at home we're there in spirit. We'll have our first updates in a few hours. Enjoy everyone. Volume 19 Match 1 - Jetta wins a battle royal and a title shot. Sara Del Rey attacks Ariel after Daizee vows to beat Chif when she returns. Match 2 - Portia Perez beats Shark Girl with her feet on the rops. Match 3 - Serena Deeb beat Danyah with a spear. Match 4 - Ashley Lane and Nevaeh beat Power and Veronica Vice. Match 5 - Kong beat Lorelei Lee with a backfist Match 6 Nikki Roxx beat Nicole Matthews with The Barbie Crusher. Match 7 Allison Danger beat Dynamite Girl with a roll up. - Danger says she is proud -Portia and Matthews interupt and make a tag match for "Top Canandians" Match 8 Lufisto beat Rain with a reverse death valley driver. Match 9 Sara Del Rey beat Ariel with the Royal Butterfly Slam. Match 10 Mercedes Martinez beat Cheerleader Melissa with a capture suplex (wonder if he means Fisherman's Buster) Match 11 MsChif beats Jetta with the desecrator. Volume 20 is starting now MsChif and Mercedes and Lafisto vs Melissa announced Match 1 - Shark Girl beat Verinica Vice with a Stunner Match 2 The Canadian Ninjas over Danger and Blake when Portia armbarred Dangers bad arm Match 3 Kong beat Danyah with the Amazing Bomb Match 4 - Cat Power beat Daffney with a figure four leg lock I Match 5 Home Wrecking Crew beat Ashley and Neveah when rain pulled Neveah's tights Match 6 Ariel over Roxx with a wheelbarrow rollup Match 7 Sara Del Rey beat Serema with a leglock after working the leg. Match 8 Melissa beat Lufisto with the Kudoh driver Match 9 Mschif over Mercedes with the Desecrator Wait, so did Kong kill Lorelei or something? Is that why she wasn't in the second half and there was a wayward Daffney appearance?
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Post by Demonic Eeyore on Jul 6, 2008 8:05:40 GMT -6
And if the young talent doesn't get shots to go out there and show what they can do, how can THEY improve? I like the young talent Dave brings in and I firmly agree with what Becky Bayless and I were talking about after the show, that this taping was better than the last one, but Vol. 20 will rank WAY up there. To me, the ONLY thing I think wasn't done correctly was start the show off with the battle royal for 2 reasons. 1) It killed off all the potential "who's coming out next?" wondering since you had everyone but MsChif in the thing so you knew who was all on the card all within the first 5 minutes and.. 2) For the returning people like Nikki and Lufi you killed off the "welcome back" reaction they would have got in the course of a normal ring introduction. I really think having the battle royal start was a huge blunder. But beyond that all these girls worked hard last night. Cat Power is developing great as is Danyah. Girl Dynamite is getting a rub from teaming from a great like Danger and the Veronica Vice has a GREAT entrance and look with the fans already singing along to her music just on the first time she used it. Sure, there were a couple of bad looking spots, mainly the Girl Dynamite chair on the outside running dropkick one which on Vol. 20 Portia herself set up by just taking a chair and setting it up, sitting on it herself and then Blake running and kicking her. Like, you had to see the match on Vol. 19 where she did it to Danger because you came out and challenged them right after it. But what are you gonna do. It's understandable to want to always see the top talent and veterans in action but look what pushing no one BUT the top talent and veterans did to WCW in the end. Jeez, Steven, could you be any more negative? OK I respect your right to your opinion but I have to ask: since 75% of the roster apparently "do nothing for you", why do you even watch? for ring marvels from Melissa, Daizee, Lacey, Del Rey, Stock, Wesna, Kong, MsChif, Mercedes, Lufisto and other alumni no longer with the company. The undercard is really weak now IMO and I don't enjoy watching most of the matches from there. And with a lack of top talent this taping, it does look to be one of the worst tapings yet. I am a fan of the company and what it represents but that doesnt mean I have to enjoy everything it puts out, if fans aren't critcal how can it improve?
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Post by Steven on Jul 6, 2008 8:16:27 GMT -6
I liked the young talent brought in at the start of SHIMMER like Tiana, Shantelle, Krissy Vaine and others, but the new batch of young wrestlers are no where near their level when they started IMO. yes they need the oppertunity to improve, but it doesn't mean I have to enjoy what I see just because they are trying. I want to see the best womens matches from women all over the world in SHIMMER, not average bores like I find the undercard to be nowadays.
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Post by Steven on Jul 6, 2008 8:19:06 GMT -6
Also in WCW, the main events were usually horrible, and the undercard was the best thing to watch so I think your example is flawed there. The problem was the wrong people were pushed in that promotion, here there just aren't enough quality women's wrestlers to fill up the card.
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Post by Demonic Eeyore on Jul 6, 2008 8:48:09 GMT -6
Also in WCW, the main events were usually horrible, and the undercard was the best thing to watch so I think your example is flawed there. The problem was the wrong people were pushed in that promotion, here there just aren't enough quality women's wrestlers to fill up the card. Well, to that I pose this question. Not counting foreign talent but in America who do you think is a "quality" woman wrestler that ISN'T in Shimmer? You may argue for someone like Mickie James or Beth Phoenix but you obviously can't WWE talent. You can say Gail Kim from TNA which *may* be a good addition but she basically is a WWE then tNA girl so she's probably never worked a 25 minute match in her life and would pass out half way through. So who's left? Everyone else in WWE sucks, The TNA girls are nothing special at all. Shimmer HAS the best from TNA already in Nikki, Kong and Melissa so where are "quality women's wrestlers" going to come from? Sure, there may be 139 awesome wrestlers in Europe or Asia or whatever but if Dave flew all of them in can you imagine what it would do to prices? So, sure, in theory Dave could present the ultimate women's wrestling card with THE 24 best women's wrestlers in the world but would you really want to pay $200 a ticket for front row, $75 for general admission and $50 per dvd to see them? These young girls are the stars of the future and I have no issues at all with how they are being used at Shimmer, but, hey, that's just my take on things.
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Post by psychoroach1985 on Jul 6, 2008 8:59:50 GMT -6
Also in WCW, the main events were usually horrible, and the undercard was the best thing to watch so I think your example is flawed there. The problem was the wrong people were pushed in that promotion, here there just aren't enough quality women's wrestlers to fill up the card. Well, to that I pose this question. Not counting foreign talent but in America who do you think is a "quality" woman wrestler that ISN'T in Shimmer? You may argue for someone like Mickie James or Beth Phoenix but you obviously can't WWE talent. You can say Gail Kim from TNA which *may* be a good addition but she basically is a WWE then tNA girl so she's probably never worked a 25 minute match in her life and would pass out half way through. So who's left? Everyone else in WWE sucks, The TNA girls are nothing special at all. Shimmer HAS the best from TNA already in Nikki, Kong and Melissa so where are "quality women's wrestlers" going to come from? Sure, there may be 139 awesome wrestlers in Europe or Asia or whatever but if Dave flew all of them in can you imagine what it would do to prices? So, sure, in theory Dave could present the ultimate women's wrestling card with THE 24 best women's wrestlers in the world but would you really want to pay $200 a ticket for front row, $75 for general admission and $50 per dvd to see them? These young girls are the stars of the future and I have no issues at all with how they are being used at Shimmer, but, hey, that's just my take on things. I have to agree with this statement. I know for me personally when I saw girls like Ashley Lane even come out on the DVD I thought "girls going to be boring" and she proved me wrong. Same thing with Eden Black and a few others. So I am never going to prejudge a wrestler again. Especially without seeing them first. I also know that a wrestler can improve leaps and bounds over the course of a few volumes. I mean At first I couldn't stand Lorelei Lee, Nikki Roxx, Tiana Ringer, or Josie but after watching their matches over several volumes and even non Shimmer matches, I realize that they're damn good and just because I didn't particularly care for the first match I saw of theirs doesn't mean I should immediately write them off. I'm willing to give a person time to grow on me. Even if it does take a while.
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Post by mercedesmartinez1 on Jul 6, 2008 9:42:36 GMT -6
but now i didn't think of something until now, Mercedes might job clean to the champ and keep losing clean but if SHIMMER ever did a Winner gets a title shot contract valid for 10 DVD tapings (5 shows) she'd win that while still jobbing and then cash it in and win the belt similar to another Chicago native who's now the World Heavyweight Champion
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Post by Demonic Eeyore on Jul 6, 2008 9:44:09 GMT -6
It's just too bad 10 shows or 5 tapings encompasses over a year and a half time. A lot of momentum can be killed in that much time. Nikki Roxx CLEARLY wasn't as over as she used to be mainly, I think, to it being a somewhat new group of Shimmer fans in attendance. The ones who started the "Nikki" "Roxx" "Other guy" "Sucks" chants don't go to Shimmer anymore so her return kinda lost something I think.
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Post by G-Reg on Jul 6, 2008 9:45:43 GMT -6
Rip off Money in the Bank?
....... Dave is quite protective of the credibility of the title, and having a title change in that manner would seriously devalue it.
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Post by mercedesmartinez1 on Jul 6, 2008 9:46:05 GMT -6
I'm just giving an example of how long the contract would be valid for
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Post by mercedesmartinez1 on Jul 6, 2008 9:48:06 GMT -6
Rip off Money in the Bank? ....... Dave is quite protective of the credibility of the title, and having a title change in that manner would seriously devalue it. but don't make it like Edge & Punk who came out of nowhere cashed it in while the champion was reeling, do it like RVD & Cena where RVD announced he was cashing in MITB at the ppv in a fair match, like have the champion win her match and then the winner of the MITB ripoff challenge for the 2nd taping, but not make it so obvious that the belt would change hands
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